Politics – The fourth thing I would do as president would be to pull out of Iraq... but with serious conditions.
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"The US must allow the Iraqis to fight a civil war. We pull out of Iraq, but not out of the area entirely. The US should build, with the help of other nations as well, a coalition base outside of the most dangerous areas in the region. That base should be on the Pakistani border, because the Pakistanis are a ******ty ally, are full of bull and need to be watched every moment and their country is a haven for Al Qaeda. The next president should travel the globe fortifying support from our allies and exhorting them to commit funds and troops to the next stage of this effort."
Maybe not but it would be a start by engaging those countries in a dialog and just might produce a workable outcome.
I don't think you're ever going to get a workabel dialog nor a workable outcome from these insane Isamlic terrorists.
You have to understand they are willing to kill innocent women and children, plants bombs anywhere, not caring who they kill. They are simply plain evil. Many countries thought they were going to get a workable dialog with Hitler and Germany right before WWII. They saw it as a sign of weakness, just as the Islamic Muslim terrorists have viewed us since the Carter Administration. 9/11 wasn't the first attack on America by them, it was simply the last straw. Enough was enough.
How about the insane Americans, who have killed 650 000 Iraqis so far? Do you think those were soldiers? Nope, they were almost all civilians!
Or the insane Americans, who supported internal fightings of the southern shias and northern Kurds against Saddam, causing possibly over 100 000 deaths?
Or the insane Americans, who hired Saddam as their champion and attack Iran, causing 8 years war with 1 000 000 casualties, and bankrupting Iraq?
Or the insane Americas, who told the Kuwaitis and Saudis request Saddam pay back the war loans, causing the bankrupt Saddam attack Kuwait?
Or the Insane America, who pushed for 13 years sanctions against Iraq, that killed about 1 000 000 Iraqis, disproportionately children?
Can you get a workable dialogue with those insane Americans, who have caused directly or indirectly the death of about 3 000 000 Iraqis so far?
How about an insane Aurinkohirvi who thinks Americans killed 650,000 civilians. I guess this idiot thinks Americans are blowing themselves up.
Obviously you can't have a dialogue with an extremist such as yourself.
Herr Shill: The one thing that is obvious is that you have no concept of justice. Or is it that you are 12 and listen to your daddy who works on K street. Or do you work on K street? People are getting p*ssed and who do you think they will come for first? Please address requested.
Al Queda doesnt care one way or another, they only want to distroy america, they declared war in the 90's not after we invaded Iraq, In fact Bin Lauden sought a truce a couple years ago, Could that be because their failing. Especially now that the Citizens are working with the police and the Iraq defense forces abandoning Iraq would be a major mistake. There would be no Mia Copa for that mistake.
Aurinkohirvi?
schillinfl1...of course you know Elvis and JKF are living in a Condo in Houston together, clandestinely of course? Many people don't know that. If you put aluminum foil around your privates you can avoid the radiation burns from the bombs they plan to explode in America.
Yes, and don't forget the hundreds of thousands killed by Saddam too. They are still turning up bodies he killed over the years.
Hitler never killed millions of Jews either. Be sure and spread that myth as well. There are some who have said that often enough they believe that too.
Of course, beheading people and showing that over the internet is truly civilized. Which god would be so pleased?
Of course you can ask the folks who discovered the bodies, in both instances.
hey buddy where did you come up with those numbers.
do you think our troops want to be over there? well the answer is no.
america helped the iraqis by getting rid of suddam. it is there own future at stake by :
1)standing up for themselves and eliminating the insurgents
2)getting over the pettiness of each sect. group
3)share the countries wealth with everyone.
until you educate the poor people in iraqi or other muslim
countries terrorists will recruit them.
the uneducated breeds ignorance and irgnorance breeds brain washing since the way they better themselves is through violence.
well said nonparted.
Most of our troops, if given a choice, would never go to battle, anywhere. But there are times when if you believe in freedom, liberty, and our ideals, and your own security you have no choice. You serve.
Right now the American education system seems designed to dumb down America. When I see some of these posts I think their plan to dumb down America is working and the uneducated breeds ignorance and irgnorance breeds brain washing. The violence in our streets is just one example?
"Hitler never killed millions of Jews either. Be sure and spread that myth as well. There are some who have said that often enough they believe that too. "
I'm hoping that your joking - or your the last person that should be talking about the American education system.
Tounge in cheek doesnt transfer well over the internet.
It does if I don't have to bend over for it.
I didn't make up the numbers. The 650.000 deaths are the best scientific estimate of the Iraqi occupation death toll. The 100.000 deaths I said in Iraq internal conflicts during Saddam, is much LOWER than generally estimated. Do your googling if you doubt. The numbers are HUGE no matter what.
The 650.000 deaths:
http://www.antiwar.com/jamail/?articleid=9859.
http://www.jhsph.edu/publichealthnews/press_rel...
The infant death rate has risen 150% from 2003 to 2005 in Iraq. Every 8th Iraqi child of under 5 years old died 2005:
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/...
Over 100.000 deaths due rebellions against Saddam:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_Sa...
1.000.000 dead from Iraq-Iran war:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_Iran_War
1.000.000 dead from Iraq sanctions
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_sanctions
I agree with your comment, but America is always trying to solve the worlds problems and make it better for people. We just don't know what we are doing. The people you are talking about don't want to solve any problems, they are the problem.
"I agree with your comment, but America is always trying to solve the worlds problems and make it better for people. "
Maybe if the UN ever steps up we won't have to.
ssinger, trying to solve the world's problems and make it better for people? Wow, that's a really, dangerously naive way of thinking you got there.
These numbers are not credible:
http://blog.washingtonpost.com/earlywarning/200...
Bush says the numbers aren't credible. Heh, heh. There's a reliable source! Read also the comments to the article of your URL! The comments and their reveal that the Iraqi health ministery and Pentagon numbers that article and Bush trusts, aren't reliable.
"It is more than 10 times the estimate of roughly 50,000 civilian deaths made by the British-based Iraq Body Count research group."
Iraq Body Count research group does NOT estimate the total casualties in Iraq. It announces the REPORTED deaths, and majority of Iraqi deaths go unreported. It is not a reliable source of estimating real total death toll, but is a way to estimate the MINIMUM death toll.
"General George Casey, the U.S. commander in Iraq, says that the highest figure he has seen of civilian deaths is 50,000."
I've stopped believing Pentagon numbers years ago: it is propaganda. They say 20 terrorists were killed, and the reality is they killed 50 civilians. It's the must unreliable source of all.
But again, it is the terrroists and militias that are killing these people, not the US>!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You're living in denyal. Sure, internal fighting kill lot's of people, as does attacks against coalition cause civilian deaths. However, according to the study:
"The Lancet interviewers asked their Iraqi respondents how their loved ones died and who was responsible. The families were very good at the cause of death, telling the reporters that over half (56%) were due to gunshots, with an eighth due each to car bombs(13%), air strikes (13%) and other ordinance (14%). Only 4% were due to unknown causes."
"The results are nevertheless staggering for those of us who read the American press: for the deaths that the victims families knew for sure who the perpetrator was, U.S. forces (or their "Coalition of the Willing" allies) were responsible for 56%."
I never said Americans killed them all. But they are the major problem in the area, supporting peace time guerilla wars, financing wars, arranging regimes, supporting regimes, and now the hot war.
"These figures sound impossible to most Americans. Certainly 300 Iraqis killed by Americans each day would be headline news, over and over again. And yet, the electronic and print media simply do not tell us that the U.S. is killing all these people. We hear plenty about car bombers and death squads, but little about Americans killing Iraqis, except the occasional terrorist, and the even more occasional atrocity story.
How, then, is the US accomplishing this carnage, and why is it not newsworthy? The answer lies in another amazing statistic: this one released by the U.S. military and reported by the highly respectable Brookings Institution: for the past four years, the American military sends out something over 1000 patrols each day into hostile neighborhoods, looking to capture or kill insurgents and terrorists. (Since February, the number has increased to nearly 5,000 patrols a day, if we include the Iraqi troops participating in the American surge.)"
"These thousands of patrols regularly turn into thousands of Iraqi deaths because these patrols are not the "walk in the sun" that they appear to be in our mind's eye. Actually, as independent journalist Nir Rosen described vividly and agonizingly in his indispensable book, In the Belly of the Green Bird, they involve a kind of energetic brutality that is only occasionally reported by an embedded American mainstream journalist.
The battles triggered by IEDs and sniper attacks almost always involve the buildings surrounding the incident, since that is where the insurgents take cover to avoid the American counter-attack. Americans, therefore, regular shoot into these buildings where the perpetrators are suspected of hiding, with all the attendant dangers of killing other people...."
Read yourself:
Killing 10,000 Iraqis Every Month
By MICHAEL SCHWARTZ
http://www.counterpunch.org/schwartz07052007.html
Give it a rest. THe US did not kill 650,000. Iraqis have killed their own people in droves. THe US has attempted to stop it with the lives of american soldiers. You sir are a traitor in saying the US army is committing genocide and murder on this scale. Your figures obviously came to you in a dream and the allocation of blame does not hold water.
Actually the study by the Johns Hopkins University's Bloomberg School of Public Health, is the most scientifically accurately done study about the death toll, and "reputable researchers have accepted the Lancet study's results as valid with virtually no dissent."
"The Lancet" that published the study, is the most prestigious BRITISH medical journal.
don't think you're ever going to get a workabel dialog nor a workable outcome from these insane Isamlic terrorists.>>>>
Terrorists? What are you referring to exactly? The Iraqi's themselves? They're terrorists? Who?
If I thought for one minute that lighting candles and singing John Lennon songs would bring peace I'd be the first one to help you light your candle, but it isn't going to work, never has. The Muslim terrorists, quite bluntly, will simply snuff out your candle, then snuff you out. It's that simple.
A quote from one of our own leaders: "The greatest threat of all, he concludes, comes from within รข;; not only from the radical mosques within every major American city but also the Islamic paramilitary compounds in rural areas throughout the country, including Islamberg in New York State, where new recruits are trained for the great jihad against the United States under the very nose of FBI and Homeland Security officials."
""I believe there are cells in the United States, or at least people who aspire to create cells in the United States,"
Americans lulled into a false sense of security in the post-9/11 era?
If you think this is over, I think you're wishful thinking. All of this actually began during the Carter Administration. This wasn't the first attack on America. Prior to this they were attacking our embassies, the USS Cole, and this was the second attack on the WTC.
You've already allowed the trojan horse within your gates. They will, if given enough time, destroy the very fabric of America, with no remorse. They are evil, just as evil if not more than Hitler.
They are evil, just as evil if not more than Bush, sorry I meant Bush, Dang there I go again calling the Kettle Hitler, I mean black. I give up, you all can sit on a Bush and rotate.
Clinton has a cigar you can borrow?
These terrorists weren't just in Afghganistan, and I think some fail to realize that. They've been creating their networks for years while we idly set back on our hands and watched, sad but true.
Now that is total BS because the longer the US stays in Iraq the more terrorist will be trained. shrub and his policies in the long run have done more damage to USA than to Iraq. Every one keeps forgetting about China, the next super power who has 1.3 Trill. in US IOU's with more every day.
ANd if we leave Iraq then the terrorist will go home. NOT. What do you think these fundamentalist will do after they no longer have a venue in the middle east? THey will be coming for you at your house. We can appease the ****** of the muslim world and give in to every demand and wi8sh that they produce but it will never be enough. Their religious agenda does not allow them to forgive, or stop the effort to convert or destroy.
Look back much farther...the struggle between Muslims and Christians (yes, the world sees us as a Christian nation whether you want to argue about if we are or not)..Do the crusades ring a bell?
You think we're gonna solve this problem? We need to get out and let Saudia Arabia and Iran fight it out..
Look back much farther...the struggle between Muslims and Christians (yes, the world sees us as a Christian nation whether you want to argue about if we are or not)..Do the crusades ring a bell?
Or in the case of America, the Barbary Pirates.
You think we're gonna solve this problem? We need to get out and let Saudia Arabia and Iran fight it out..
"decisive victory will only come when potential terrorist recruits are dissuaded from joining the cause, and persuaded that their own sacrifices are likely to be for naught."
"The end of war as we knew it? Insurgency, counterinsurgency and lessons from the forgotten history of early terror networks" Third World Quarterly
Why would they stop their jihad? Their own leaders have not only faIled to provide stability and a future for their citizens and through state religion they tell the masses that they are in poverty and humiliation because of the policies of the west. Why do they not take responsibility for their lack of governance? You seem to be able to blame the US for just about everything evil that has ever transpired. If the muslims are still upset about the crusades then the mentality we are dealing with cannot be rationalized and talking points are non existent.
Now go get yourself another drink Baldwin.
Can I have one too? If we fool around and play patty cake with these Arab Muslim terrorists any more, we might all want one.
America has a problem with dealing with its own criminals. Last week while I was picking up a copy of a traffic accident report I asked for a list of sex offenders. OMG! Unbelievable that we allow this many people to live after committing those acts, let alone turn them loose and let them move back into your neighborhood.
Time for a Bruskie...and I don't even drink!
I don't think the corporatists who own both the Republicans and the Democrats will allow such a solution. After all, Iraq is their "favoritest" cash cow. These low-lifes have learned over the years since the beginning of our nation, from the Civil War to World War I to WWII and Vietnam, that war literally guarantees huge profits. Oh sure, they bankrupt the taxpayer. But corporatists don't give a damn about taxpayers, especially when they own the government and are able to reduce their own taxes.
No, Iraq will continue burning until it burns itself out. The longer it takes, the better, as far as those in control are concerned.
You are absolutely right! They are, on both sides hostage to the corporate money, Republicans and the Democrats.
Your cigarette manufacturers were putting chemicals in the cigs to addict you to them. Recently the fast food chains were discovered to have been doing the same thing. The pet food scandal they found that putting melomine (ground up counter tops?) into the pet food made them test higher for proteins therefore they made more money. When they recalled the pet food, they repackaged it and sent it back out to hog farmers? Hogs are more resilient?
Just plain greed... But hasn't it always been so? As I recall didn't Jesus get disgusted and throw the moneychangers out of the temple? They murdered Him?
Sooner or later, whether we leave now, or in several years, the Iraqis will come to an accomodation with each other, and the result may not be pretty to us, something for which we would like to have sacrified our lives and fortune. This is not something that can be imposed from the outside for very long.
http://www.ericblumrich.com/thanks.html
There is only one problem with that analysis. It is like saying that if Canadians and Mexicans were fighting each other somewhere in the U.S., that all of a sudden this conflict becomes a civil war in the United States. The Al Qaeda Muslim terrorist are usually not from Iraq. They are evil and their tactics are fear and intimidation. They are coming in from Iran, Syria, the neighboring countries.
The Iraqi's are not strong enough to push them out by themselves.
But I agree with one thing. We did not put enough troops into the fight, and some have this insane notion that our military are policemen. They are not, are not trained to be policemen, are not supposed to be policemen. A soldier's job is to kill the enemy before they are killed. It is that simple.
This conflict appears to have begun to escalate during the Carter Administration, not Bush, and the fact that the Israelis wanted to kill Yassar Araphat over 25 years ago and we stuck our noses into it.
"This conflict appears to have begun to escalate during the Carter Administration, not Bush, and the fact that the Israelis wanted to kill Yassar Araphat over 25 years ago and we stuck our noses into it"
Are you rewritting history? This conflict, as you put it, began to escalate when Reagan pulled out of Lebanon. He showed that our government didn't have the resolve to stay and help negotiate a true peace in the region. Nor did we have the resolve to go after and get the ones responsible.
DUH!!!
If they had, you'd be dealing with the same wackos you're answering to today. Those were Muslim terrorists in Lebanon as well. We backed out to let that government take care of their own problem. We see how successful that was. So why not back out of here too?
Hmmm...how far do you retreat until there is no ground to retreat to? I would not assume they're not coming here because they are already here.
Lebanon was destroyed by the PLO. After King Hussein (the last sane Hussein?) booted the troublemakers out of Jordan, Lebanon allowed them there. Big mistake.
Some of our military units in Iraq are actually having success over there now. It's because, rather than staying neutral, I guess the generals have decided to take sides. Rather than not knowing who the terrorists are and who they are not, they are allowing Sunni Militia free reign in some of these areas.
Sunni don't try to disarm them, take them off to a prison camp in Cuba or anywhere else and feed them at our expense. They simply execute them right on the spot. And since most if not all are Sh~eites, Sunnis also solve their own problems of dealing with another Muslim sect, and they are not only locals but are coming from Iran, which is where most of supplies, bombs, and other IEDs are coming from.
I know some of the troops that are on the ground. Since this latest push there is hope. Prior to that they'd take an area, move on to another, and while they were moving on, the evil terrorists would move back into the area they left and start the terror all over again. Do-over.
Hope for what? Defeating the "terrorists"? If you believe you can defeat terrorism with an army, your sadly mistaken. I am not willing to give up anymore freedom than has already been stolen through the Patriot Act so I can "feel" safe. Last thing I need is a Bush or a Hillary telling me what is best for my family and I. Look how they've screwed up their lives and familys.