Politics – Ohio - Hillary Rodham Clinton suggested she will press on following crucial primaries Tuesday, arguing that momentum was on her side despite 11 straight losses to rival Barack Obama that have imperiled her Democratic presidential nomination bid.
She's got to keep putting out this message that she's going to win, what else can she do? It'll be interesting to see how the campaigns change after this next round of state primaries. Much has been said and written concerning a fractured Democratic party should Hillary continue to fight after losing Texas and/or Ohio. It seems to me that the Dems are always fragmented over something so that party should be able to handle another few months of nomination battling without irreparable harm.
FTA:
"McCain's nominee-in-waiting status has put pressure on Democratic leaders to bring their party's historic but increasingly negative nominating contest to an end because they fear that a drawn out battle could hurt the party's chances in the November election."
This seems to be a popular concept and I can understand the argument but I see it EXACTLY opposite.
As long as H & B are merrily jousting McC won't be able to focus his jousting and he'll have to maintain an anti-woman AND anti-black campaign simultaneously. Not such a pretty picture...
Meanwhile if B & H joust meaningfully and passionately and manage to keep it clean they will both be earning lots of respect and we'll get to see them dealing with some real issues between each other.
Maybe I'll be proved completely wrong but that's my take right now.
Excellent analysis gama! Well thought out! Maybe you should be on the strategy team.
I didn't realise I'd used "jousting" so much!
I guess its my "knight-in-shining-armour complex" getting out of hand again!
pssst-- it IS possible to not support Obama and/or Hilary without being a racist or a misogynist...
But it is difficult to support the GOP if you're not.
you know, I have always wondered why it makes me more of a racist to tell how groups and classes of people that they are so "disadvantaged" (aka inferior?, stupid?) that they can't possibly accomplish anything unless we lower the standards for them rather than just insisting that they go to school, educate themselves and take personal responsibility that they can accomplish pretty much what they want.
Wow, you really are a racist, aren't you? Must be, if that's how you define the idea of "equal rights".
"Inferior" and "stupid" I reserve for those that don't seem to understand how big of a bigot they are. It's those 'unrealized' racists like yourself that the laws are for. You discriminate without realizing. It drips from your words. Those groups and classes of people need legal protections from people like you who would deny the racism in their decision making.
wow, yourself.
I have students that can't (or won't) speak standard English -- I am not allowed to work with them to correct their English and diction -- that's considered racist by the politically correct. As a result, many of these people -- who are as bright and intelligent as anyone else are absolutely unmarketable for any position other than menial labor.
I have had some of these students who want to get ahead tell me that they if they speak properly in their homes or their neighborhoods, they are given grief for being "uppity" or "talking white". This is NOTHING that affirmative action can fix --and, in fact, is more likely to exacerbate.
The commissioner or chief of the state police in CT announced that the scores on testing for promotion (not hiring, so presumably everyone is exposed to the same corporate culture) would now be 85%. He is being denounced far and wide as a racist -- because the minorities will not be able to meet that score.
Why not? Why should they be less capable of getting a decent score than anyone else?
Am I saying there is no racism left in US society? Absolutely not, but giving groups "permission" not to strive for excellence is not helping them or anyone else. In addition, affirmative action taints everyone who is part of that group as inferior -- and then they have to work much harder to "prove" themselves.
Giving people jobs or admittance to schools that they are totally unprepared and unqualified for only sets them up for failure, and coincidentally, gives those who would oppress more ammunition for their fire.
re-reading my original comment, I sure garbled what I was trying to say -- to rephrase -- I believe that affirmative action is what is telling people that they can't make it on their own, and is, in fact, more racist than telling people to go to school, do as well as you can and take personal responsibility.
I would like to blame Propeller for mangling my message, but, in this case, I'm sure it was me!
You may be right that some people view those who benefited from affirmative action as inferior, and maybe affirmative action already did the job it was supposed to do, and now it's time to abandon it. However, many people succeeded, and benifited from affirmative action.
For those who complain that it was affirmative action that kept them out of a college or a job, look at the numbers. The likelihood that YOU were the ONE that was displaced by the very small numbers of those who were given preference is minute. It is more likely, but maybe not certain, that there were other reasons you were not among the very much larger group of whites admitted. Just think of it as you were competing against the very large group of whites not against the very small group given preference.
As a woman who worked in a male dominated field for a while, I have been the recipient of actual affirmative action or, at least, perceived affirmative action. It wasn't a warm, fuzzy place to be. In fact, although I did my job well, it was such an unpleasant place to be that I have switched fields.
It is also true that in a highly competitive situation, such as top-tier college admissions, you are also competing agains gazillions of other qualified white people as well -- and many of them, who are equally qualified, will also be rejected. But that only makes it even MORE aggravating when someone with "only" 12-1300 on their SAT's gets in because their a minority, but you're 1590, straight A's in honors and AP classes, service and extras don't get you in.
Another way of saying it: White people with good grades are a dime a dozen, but a minority with chances of success is a rare gem. Even if all the preferences were eliminated, only a very few additional white folks would be admitted, and you might STILL not be among them: the pool of available places for whites is huge, in comparison with places lost to preferences. For a college, or an employer, the value that the few preferences provides to the whole population, is as great as the value provided by unique characteristics of applicants, like excellence in leadership, or sports or creative arts.
OF COURSE it is, Amazed!
I'm sure that you and I and the majority of members of propeller could do so.
But unfortunately in real-politik the lines are so crudely drawn that the distinctions get blurred and issues finish up being very much drawn in black and white.
I would have voted for a 3-legged short-nosed aardvark rather than for a number of the original cast of candidates..
The residue are all clearly members of the human race..
I never had to wonder how Amazed got his/her moniker. It is truly amazing that anyone could call themselves educated, and/or an educator, and get on a social news internet site and spew such bigotry, racism and prejudice without being truly amazing.
I'm failing to see the bigotry? Any particular reason everyone shouldn't have the same educational system and any particular reason the bar shouldn't be set high? Besides, I've always looked at is as a class issue regarding education as opposed to a race one with education...
thanks, but save your fingers...
N2N and I go quite a ways back== she doesn't agree with me on much of anything, nor I her. She also insists on attributing to me (and almost everyone else she disagrees with) the most evil and nasty motives she can attribute to them -- read her posts about anyone who is not extremely liberal, in general. We are all evil, corrupt and greedy bastards, while those on the left are, without exception, selfless, pure and saintly.
If you are a Texan, you skew the polls by lying to pollsters. Besides, Rush is pushing Republicans to crossover, and vote for Hillary. Hillary isn't going away. She has $35 million dollars, and she is collecting more, and shes staying until someone gets 2,025 delegates. It looks like Mr Wonderful peaked too soon. He was having trouble answering questions about his mentor, Mr Rezko today.
>>If you are a Texan, you skew the polls by lying to pollsters
And you know that as a Texan, or by hearsay?
Seems O.K. to me unless you're saying that the lying is more endemic in one camp than another; it should even out.
BTW, if you ARE a Texan please don't bother to respond to this - we'll deduce whatever we want about you anyway.
If we haven't already.
Hillary facts
1. She is going to court for illeagal campaign funding
2. Experience/ Bill was notified that N. Korea had a under ground nuke program but ignored it and did nothing because he was spending his time on his impeachment case because of Monica.Source a former member of Clintons staff. So much for national security!
3. Pro NAFTA supporter.
4.Failed health care plan because she was unable to work with others on it. Her way or NO way.
5. Many business ties with China.
Need more reasons not to vote for Billary....
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FTA:
Four states vote Tuesday, but the focus is on races in the big states of Texas and Ohio. The former first lady desperately needs wins in both states to salvage her once-powerful bid to become the U.S.'s first female president.
"I'm just getting warmed up," Clinton told reporters on Monday, looking ahead to a busy day of campaign events in Ohio and Texas where polls show a close race. Her husband, former President Bill Clinton, has asserted that his wife must win both states to keep her campaign alive.
"Clinton says she still has momentum"
Free falling will do that, till ya hit bottom
In Clinton's defense, polling data over the last 72 hours has seen a modest shift toward Hillary Clinton. What was the cause of it... The SNL appearence? The negative ads including the 3AM fear ad about experience?
A win by Hillary in both Ohio and Texas will be somewhat of a moral boost for her even though its unlikely she will see much of a delegate gain out of it. Its very possible that Obama could lose the popular vote in Texas but still come away with more delegates because of the primacaucus system in play there. The small delegate gains that she may make tonight might very well be erased within the next week as Wyoming caucuses this weekend and Mississippi holds a primary next week. Obama is currently favored in both.
Assuming she does win Ohio and Texas - look for the Clinton campaign to harp strongly on the Michigan and Florida delegates. A redo in Florida alone could mean a sizable haul of pledged delegates for her.
going back to todays contest and Texas. The campaigns ground team will be the key today. Who will get their voters to the polls? Clinton needs a heavy turnout among Hispanics, and Obama needs the same from the African American community. Texas should be the closest of the four races tonight. IMO this state could go either way.
Rush Limbaugh telling his listeners to vote for Hillary might in the end be the difference in this state.
Plus recall that a great % of voters have already voted early , like days ago or weeks. This means the remaining people voting today who can in principle reflect the polls are only a fraction of the total which will derive contribution from the running polls going back weeks. It is the reason why Clinton won California by the way. In the 20% of the early voters she was having some 20 point lead and the real lead in the day of the election was more like 5-6%. In our case here the so called momentum shift is more like a tiny shift that nay end up not impacting the end result all that much. Also as you said the delegate count may actually lead to an Obama increase of the differential when all 4 states are added.
I find it iritating that more time in a stressed situation Clinton spends the more she turns to be a true republican in principle and action methodology. Her logic and behavior is that of a conservative under cover operator...People do see through that you know eventually.
Notice how she had absolutely no problem offering credit to McCain regarding the 3am phonecall BS over Obama. In principle she finds it convenient to betray the unity of her party. She may have a record of a democrat in some surface principle level but her methods are massively machiavellian. She is cold and calculating and motivated by a very well planned long term coordinated effort to get to the presidency. Becoming a president should be something natural. It should be some inevitable ability to rise to a historical call that derives power from your totality of experience and answers an urgency of the present. Something in you that ultimately converges to motivation and activation of the higher virtues of the masses . It shouldnt be something coordinated and planned decades ago. It shouldnt be something that exploits sentiments of fear and distortion of the truth and that ethically bankrupts integrity in the name of the final objective. Much like republicans she promotes division.
How pathetic indeed to be trying to inspire fear to people about 3am stupid concepts of experience. How simplistic. A true leader doesnt have to derive strength from a 3am random event. A true leader PREVENTS the urgency of a 3am call. A true leader PREPARES in advance for that 3am call so that the action is already a rational one and a well studied one. A true leader has created an infrastructure. A president is as good as his/her ability to put to good use the intellectual capacity of advisors and other key members of the administration. A true leader has more than all integrity and judgement that derives strength from a great deal of prior intellectual efforts to understand how the world functions, how human nature operates and how one can pronote a broad structural progress across all society. The true leader faces that 3am call as typically precalculated step. The future is dictated by how you rationally respond to that 3am call well after you have received it. (see 9/11)
Hillary has this sense of "entitlement" and it ticks most people off. I wouldn't trust her with my security as she couldn't even handle her marriage!!!! She is for big business and would further extend an administration which is against the middle class. She voted for the fictitious war too.
Pardon me but she is a "disaster"
Not a Hillary supporter, but I'd like to know how you think she hasn't managed her marriage rightfromwrong?
I live in Ohio and I gotta say, I'm sick to death of getting phone calls several times each day for the last 2 weeks, they are relentless.
I personally know 2 two time Bush supporters and somewhat racist, who said yesterday they are voting for Obama, I was very surprised!!!
I would have kicked that lying, cheating, bastard to the curb. She would be stronger and have more respect (not to mention less fear of a repeat of the last Clinton presidency) without him.
Did it ever occur to you that she takes her marriage vows seriously? Did it ever occur to you that she loves the man and knows his flaws and has accepted him even though he s not perfect? Has it ever occurred to you that it is her marriage and it her business and nobody else's why she chooses to stay in her marriage? So you would not have voted for JFK because he cheated on his wife? How about FDR? How about Jefferson? I suggest to you if you cannot honestly say you would not have voted for any of those three that you check your motives for holding Hillary to your double standard.
Well said Red!
Amen!
You're absolutely right. There are many reasons I won't vote for Hillary, but that's not one of them.
Did it occur to you that the only reason she might be taking her marriage seriously is because of the current election that was planned decades ago? I have no problem with her family crisis back then. Its more a husband problem than hers although a truly visionary woman knows exactly how to handle such guy! The problem i vastly have is that it appears to me that it has all been a long term calculation from the very first day of that marriage. Now that said i could be wrong and i apologize to her for saying that . But it sure seems that way if you examine her entire calculating behavior in every other situation you can inspect her.
exactly my point RedstateLib! I think if anything she managed that very well, she had to have had alot of strength to go through all that crap that was laid at her feet.
he cheated on her, probably more than once and she presumably had no idea this was happening.
And you point is?
oops, your point is?
Or maybe she did it amd was the price to pay for the arrangement later. You are getting close to my problem with her. She is the kind of person that gives the impression she will sacrifice things that are supposed to be matters of deep principle in order to achieve later other objectives (the iraq war vote and her position on it since then is the ultimate example of doing what is short term convenient and doesnt create friction at the peril of a country much later) . This is the very definition of machiavellian behavior. Is this the type of person you want for president, someone that compromises for other objectives? A woman that can forgive easily such a life long pattern of abuse is either doing it for her child or for other reasons. If she did it for her child she is brave if the other reasons are in place we have a problem!
On a funnier note take a look at the picture of the story. I mean can a woman look for vindictive, calculating and ready to get in fight? How inspiring for a country! And this is the promise of the future, ala Thatcher. Sure. Bring me a woman you can fall in love with her intellect and soul at the same time . Until then i will continue to think that if the answer of America to Bush is Clinton then we do indeed have confirmation of a very disturbing internal collapse of the citizen...It is better to take a whatever you want to name risk with a younger , inspirational, new attitude , more intelligent guy that has nothing to do with the established family feud . At least if that too fails we will know there is a serious internal problem with this society and we would require massive self reflection. But we have to rise up and take a last stand in the proper direction otherwise we are no better than a monarchy or a thrird world country that has families monopilize leadership for decades.
And in case there is any doubt , of course all democrats can unite behind Clinton if it were to be the case. There is no doubt that some principles are better than others and still one can choose the person you dont like but holds more logical positions than the ones the other party seems so intolerant about. However at some point it has to be important to matter to all that the one that gets elected represents a unifying movement that embraces all people and does not remind people of old feuds. I personally hold responsible the Clintons for allowing a great presidency to deteriorate to the point that someone like Bush would be electable. Some mistakes done by otherwise good trending people are significant for the history of a country. I hold responsible equally all those ignorants that elected Bush , embraced his simplistic approach of things and those that facilitated that election by allowing the republican machine to get a moralistic argument against the better party.
Funny note on the 3 am fear ad. Last Sunday I was in a bar watching the Nascar ace and the ad came on, when it got to the pause after the 'who do you want to answer the phone' part, and a chorus went up, MCCAIN!. LOL