Politics – "This proposal does not honor the 600,000 votes that were cast in Michigan's January primary. Those votes must be counted,"
Poor Obama. Hillary's biggest moneied supporter is talking to the Democrats about a re vote in Florida, and Michigan. He is a very rich, powerful Democrat. We will soon see whether they can follow through on their rules, or if they cave for the money. If they have a revote, Hillary wins the popular vote, and the Delegate count. How could these people find themselves in such a convoluted mess?
The answer to that is already in. Nancy Pelosi told Weinstein to never threaten her again.
It's an idle threat anyway. Obama has raised enough money in small contributions over the internet to buy Harvey Weinstein and ship him off-shore.
But if you want types like this running things behind the curtains, elect Hillary or McCain. Fat cat donors, lobbyists and big bundlers give both of them the build of their money. Either one will give you business as usual, the best leadership money can buy.
If Florida, and Michigan delegates are not seated, and I hope they are not, Democrats lose two battleground states to McCain on general principles. And American voters can see how Democrats respect the "every vote counts" rule they made for themselves by disenfranchising over 2 million voters. 2 million votes can be the difference between winning, and losing. Hillary's right, Obama is not electable. Bagala said they can't win with just Eggheads, and Africans. It's 1972 all over again, and this was supposed to be the Democrats big year.
Of course you don't for it has been quite obvious for some time that neoclowns like yourself care little for honor, integrity, ethical behavior or the democratic process. This has been clearly demonstrated by your continued kneejerk support of the acts of the current administration and GW Bush!
It is also quite obvious that you haven't got the first f*cking clue what you are talking about for you assume, incorrectly, that Obama is unelectable when every poll for months has shown just the opposite.
What folks like ani overlook (or deliberately ignore?) is that Obama was a relatively obscure Junior Senator who ran against opponents with much higher name recognition and managed not only to gain the lead in the race, but to rack up a record number of individual donors from a grass roots effort. And this guy is 'unelectable'? Give me a freakin' break!
Ratskii is dead on. It's wishful thinking on both ani AND Hillary's part! Just like the whole 'stealth Muslim' thing (on which ani seems to have given up), if you repeat 'unelectable' enough times, maybe the meme will stick.
Every vote SHOULD be counted. PERIOD!
Then hold a re-vote in both States!
by cutting Michigan and Florida out, the democratic candidate selection process, has been hopelessly tainted. It's really to late to do a do-over -- had they counted, Kucinich, Biden, Edwards and who ever else I don't remember would get few notes today, but they might have done very well when the field was open totally changing the overall outcome.
The respective legislatures in Michigan and Florida along with the Democratic Parties in both states are the ones that chose to go against the rules established by the DNC and are the ones responsible.
Both Hillary and Barack agreed, from the very beginning, that they would not count the votes from any State that violated the rules set forth by the DNC. Now, with her back to the wall, Hillary wants to change the rules and that is just wrong. If a re-vote is out of the question then the delegates from both States should be divided equally between them. That is the fair and equable solution.
The respective legislatures in Michigan and Florida
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Which in Florida (I'm not positive about Michigan) is REPUBLICAN. Since they KNEW that the RNC would NEVER actually abide by the rules they set down (history has proven THAT lack of consistency) then if the DNC doesn't fold also it makes the RNC look more voter friendly and the DNC look like it wants to 'pick and choose' who gets a voice in choosing the nominee. Then you ADD the position that no one would be willing to vote for a Democrat (in the General Election) in FL & MI and you IMMEDIATELY have 54 Electoral Votes.
The SAD part is that this way of thinking means the Republican ACTUALLY believe that most American think that changing (or IGNORING) the rules for the benefit of a few (2 million is a few when you are talking about a population of hundreds of millions) is OK.
Then maybe someone can tell me why G.W.B. doing that has given him a 69% DISAPPROVAL rating?
Hum, For a group of people (Democrats)that is always gripping about how they want THIER (DEMOCRATS) vote to count sure are easily swayed when it comes to others wanting their vote counted. You Democrats are a greedy people. As a (Republican) I believe in fair and balanced for all Americans. Now ain't y'all ashamed? SHAME! SHAME!
the only person who cares is Hillary, because she has once again flipped on the dnc's omish of the states delegates. It is what ever fits her needs at that time, this is how she would run the country, by by hillary
yeah sure. Bet if it was Obama you would have a different tune to sing.
You are so right ranchhand.
Besides Obama rejected past attempts to deal with the problem in Michigan and Florida because he was afraid it would help Clinton but now that Obama's ahead it's a different story and these two states should be dealt with NOW. So now he's ready to agree to solve the problem. Change? Sounds like old politics to me. So what's with all the whining. It's her turn to reject a plan to fix the problem. Fair is fair.
Nice bit of factually incorrect spin there fella.
Obama pledged, as did Clinton, not to count either the votes or delegates from any state that violated the rules put forth by the DNC and he has stood by that position. Hillary, on the other hand has not and kept her name on the Michigan ballot when she had the chance to remove it and actively campaigned in both Florida and Michigan.
Perhaps you can support an individual that reneges on his or her word, but I cannot!
How about the PEOPLE who voted in good faith? Don't their voices count one iota?
What you neoclowns ignore is the FACT that the voters in both States were well aware of the potential consequences and some chose to go out and vote anyway. Sorry, but that is not "voting in good faith" no matter how hard you tax your brain trying to spin it!
Leave to you libs to start throwing stones, HUH? Did it feel good? You want what you want and no one else's opinion matters. IF the People felt that the Democrats ruled the world, Oh I mean their lives, Oh That they had rights. That the dnc were the last word.Then they would have never wasted their time to vote. Get over it, you ain't God. So quit trying to fashion the world to your own liking.
Unlike you neoclowns I have never attempted to play god. It's funny you hypocrites make a big deal about accepting personal responsibility for your actions yet try your damnedest to shift the blame to anyone but yourselves!
btw - If I really had the desire to throw stones I would have used far more pejorative, yet highly accurate and descriptive, terms when referring to you and your ilk. At best I tossed a pebble or two and kept it simple so that it wouldn't be too difficult for you to comprehend knowing your difficulties in that area!
Obama like Clinton, agreed to follow the decision of the DNC. And has never changed that position.
He has said, from the beginning, that there need to be SOME solution, but that solution needs to come from the DNC (NOT the candidates).
Unlike Clinton, who has been 'campaigning' for HER solution, Obama has stayed out of it and said it should be decided by the DNC and should be as fair as possible given that his name was NOT on the ballot in Michigan and he did not campaigning in Florida. Neither of which Clinton can say.
Why don't they just erase all the votes start all over and let former contenders run. Have the elections for all states at one time? Maybe people will realize they are fed up with Clinton and Obama and elect Biden.
Amen!! All the states voting on the same day would be WONDERFUL!!!
If the process could vet the candidates down to 2, I'd be inclined to agree. But let's take a field of Obama, Clinton, Edwards, Biden, Kucinich, and Richardson. Do you really think one of the candidates would have emerged with more than half of the vote?
There are voting methods that allow for a second choice, or perhaps there could be an elimination round of voting.
I do agree the current primary process is pretty whacked!
Tangent I know a lot of people that don't vote in the primaries and one vote on the same day for all parties, Democrats, Republicans, Independents, Ect. Winners of each take all. that would cause the media a big pain in the ars. Just for that reason alone would bring a smile to my face.
say have debates for all Democrats, Then Republicans. Then for all the parties. Let them show their platform and ideas on the issues. Would save a lot of time and more time to see what the people really want and need. And less time fighting members of their own party. Also get rid of the super delegates.
First round of votes, in January. California, Missouri, Ohio and Florida places like that. Political belwethers who tend to vote with the final choice in a general election and are fairly representative of the country as a whole. It will tell us more then Iowa and New Hampshire. Second round of voting, the big states that were left out in the first round like New York. Third round, the small states who may get the final voice in a close contest. Make each contest a full month apart.
I sadly know that people have had it up to here with the precious time to discuss the real issues confronting Americans and the world. We need answers, ideas, and solutions from all three candidates. Is our Democracy based upon voters fighting each other ad nauseum while the candidates happily trade the "he said, she said stories?" We have great need for a leader, someone who will stand toe-to-toe with special interests and lobbyists let them know their party is OVER!!! We need a uniter, one who will talk straight.
There is not one member I have ill-feelings for. None here had anything to do with 09/11! We should all be pounding on the doors in congress, and in the senate telling them we are flat tired of their greedy ways. I am not on anyone's side, save the truth.
Let's give them a time limit! If they can't or won't deal with it, I bet my life there are Americans who can do far better than anyone in Washington will do.
Airborne all the way...
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She simply doesn't give a damn about the Democratic party and wants to steal the election. After all, she is entitled isn't she?
If she wants to count votes where she was the only viable candidate, she isn't just turning her back on the Democratic Party, she's rejecting the democratic process as well.
There should be some compromise to seat the delegates from Florida and Michigan. Let the two campaigns find a solution both can live with.
But there should be consequences for those two states breaking the rules. If everyone knows you can ignore the rules, then next election it will be the Anarchy Party.
This should set a precedent, otherwise every state that wants to will hold an early primary, then demand a do over.
Yes, I can see a cascade of leapfrog where every successive state votes to move their primary to the front of the line so they have the greatest influence. We'd soon be voting to see which candidate's grandchild should go on the ballot 50 years in the future.